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TelGonzie

09 January 2024

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Suspected sockpuppets

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In November 2022, there was extensive discussion with an editor whose previous account name revealed their identity at Talk:State-recognized tribes in the United States#Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas and their role within the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas (wanting to change names in this instance is completely understandable).

After this discussion, a possible WP:Sleeper account, User:TelGonzie was created and performed Newcomer Tasks on 11/27/2023 and began editing Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas on 12/30/2023.

User:Fallenacorn was created on 12/07/2022. They performed four Newcomer tasks, then switched to discussion about Talk:List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes#Groups that have acknowledgment from federally recognized comminutes., advocating for special mention of the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas, an unrecognized tribe.

User:Magigoosh was created on 12/2023 and began overhauling Lipan Apache people on 12/11/2023 to promote the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas at the expense of the other unrecognized tribes in Texas identifying as Lipan Apache descendants. DIFF removing "Lipan Apache Nation of Texas" and singling the user's group, Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas, out as "acknowledged by governing Apache tribes" DIFF. Magigoosh carried this WP:OR, WP:POV notion of being "acknowledgement and community from federally recognized tribes" over to Talk:List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes, one DIFF as an example.

User:Fallenacron their concept of tribes being recognized by established tribes to List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes, DIFF and again here DIFF saying "were prior approved by consensus" in the edit summary.

User:FactBanquet was created on 01/08/2024 and made a single edit, contributing to Talk:List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes: DIFF.

User:Kilnarak was created on 01/09/2024 and made single edit to Talk:List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes, DIFF.

User: Tsideh was created on 01/09/2024 and made single edit to Talk:List of organizations that self-identify as Native American tribes, DIFF.

I didn't issue many warning templates (for WP:COI, WP:OR, WP:NPOV and WP:PROMO), since most of the conversation was happening on talk pages, which seems fine, but, instead of the situation calming, these new accounts keep popping up (a new one even while I've been typing this), so I'm not entirely sure what to do to abate this. Yuchitown (talk) 16:29, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Missed one User:Tséná´áéthunder, created on 1/7/2024, whose first four edits were to Category:American people who self-identify as being of Lipan Apache descent and fifth edit was to Darcie Little Badger, DIFF
Missed an IP, 136.49.160.186. Collective user doesn't care for Category:American people who self-identify as being of Lipan Apache descent and removed it from Margo Tamez's article DIFF. Tamez is a member of the Lipan Apache Band of Texas, another unrecognized organization from which the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas broke away.

The individual is affiliated with the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas but seldom touches that article, just other related articles and categories attempting to promote the organizations's POV. Do we just revert and otherwise ignore them? What is the best practice? Yuchitown (talk) 16:25, 22 January 2024 (UTC)Yuchitown[reply]

  • Tsideh has basically admitted to off-wiki canvassing in this edit "That I know of, there's only one international forum for reaching consensus on this question: International Indian Treaty Council (IITC). They've been invited to join because what this page contradicts the only broadly-reached consensus on the question of recognition." This was said in response to Netherzone questioning how an editor who only made one edit found this particular discussion. --ARoseWolf 21:26, 22 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users

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Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments

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Tsideh's my only account, ever. And I don't know Tsena or Fact. I did go back and read some of their comments and found both their interests and writing styles to be quite different from mine (ask your favorite college prof for their rec on a plagiarism-checking app). I deem this accusation that I'm a duplicate account or merely a Dito head, versus someone who's very interested and well-read on the subject of Indigenous identity, to be a bad faith accusation meant to eliminate opposing POVs via an ad hominem attack instead of a cogent argument. Note that I haven't attacked anybody as MPs no matter the obvious philosophical affinity and coordination, including the admonitions appearing in my WP inbox. I genuinely view the voluminous discussion that's been generated on the topic of Indian Identity as a net positive resource for anybody who's interested in the latest thinking on the subject. I say let the WP readers-- and ChatGPTs that scour the talks as much as the WP pages-- decide for themselves if my arguments and citations in favor of self-determination are more convincing than the yet-undocumented POV that only the US govt can confer Indigenous identity-- backed up by counter arguments of mostly Wiki-speak POOs.

26 October 2024

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Suspected sockpuppets

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TelGonzie is the blocked sockpuppet master of User:Fallenacorn, User:SquirrelPup, User:SummerSquirrel, User:Rainbowshell, and possibly User:Kilnarak and User:Madigoosh (blocked for other reasons).

In November 2022, there was extensive discussion with an editor whose previous account name revealed their identity at Talk:State-recognized tribes in the United States#Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas and their role within the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas (wanting to change names in this instance is completely understandable).

After this discussion, a possible WP:Sleeper account, User:TelGonzie was created and performed Newcomer Tasks on 11/27/2023 and began editing Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas on 12/30/2023.

TelGonzie's subjects of interest were articles relating to the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas and disliking the use of the term "self-identify." DIFFs Editing areas included:

User:TelGonzie was blocked for sockpuppetry on 1/9/24

User:Whitewolfdog1 created a new account on 1/14/24 starting with their user page, second edit was to their user page [1].

Their third-ever edit was to the Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard to ask if an “Official US Government Letter" was a reliable source, specifically in regard to the Lipan Apache Tribe of Texas (LATT) DIFF (LATT–related accounts repeatedly have been told that unpublished sources don't quality for WP:CITE.

Their fifth-ever edit was to the Wikipedia:Help desk to remove a category from the LATT's article DIFF. Subsequent edits are along the same lines as TelGonzie:

etc.

Of course, it's fine to ask questions and voice strong opinions. It's just not okay to create new accounts to avoid a block for sockpuppetry. Yuchitown (talk) 01:39, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users

[edit]
Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments

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