Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/German-Russian pidgin
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. Majorly (hot!) 20:14, 16 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- German-Russian pidgin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
This supposed 'pidgin' does not seem to have been the subject of non-trivial coverage by any published works. I can't find any references to this language on Google, Google Book Search, or JSTOR, whether under "German-Russian pidgin" or "Quelia" or "Qweля" or "Deutschrussich", except for a single website. Ptcamn 19:38, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Strong keep This is an English tranaslation of a German article that has German sources. Need to clean up not delete RaveenS 17:47, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- By "sources" you mean "two external links", one of which is the website I mentioned above, and the other of which is this short article (also available in English), which only briefly mentions it (and seems to say it's slang rather than a separate language or "pidgin"). You'll have to do better than that. --Ptcamn 18:17, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Strong Keep Per updated references section, which includes print references and online articles from reliable sources such as the Goethe-Institut. It's clearly a contact variety documented by linguists, but since the status of the variety is unclear, suggest moving article to German-Russian contact speech or something similar. Also suggest adding more info from the German version. It's not clear in the English version that the contact variety developed among Volga German communities and was later transplanted to Germany as a result of German Right of Return laws, which is what I believe the German and Russian linguistic studies indicate. Unfortunately, I'm not up to the translation right now though. Aelffin 22:47, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment Compare with Dunglish, Engrish, Franglais, Poglish, Spanglish, Swenglish, Singlish, Chinook Jargon, Taglish, Runglish, Czenglish, Siculish, Russenorsk etc. Aelffin 23:12, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Uh... those are some very different phenomena. Russenorsk was a pidgin developed for communication between groups that didn't speak each others' languages, Spanglish is an English-influenced variety of Spanish spoken by bilinguals, and Engrish isn't a variety at all, but a term for errors produced by people who do not speak English, often with the help of machine translation. Exactly which of these is Quelia supposed to be comparable to?
- I would suggest moving it to an established name rather than neologizing. --Ptcamn 02:26, 12 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Like this article, each of these articles documents a product of language contact. Quelia is a contact variety of Russian, under the influence of German and it is at least as well-sourced as the other articles I linked to. The term "pidgin" has a very specific meaning, as does the term "slang" and neither really applies here, but pidgin is closer. Aelffin 05:56, 12 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Strong Keep with the references, per Aelffin. Carlossuarez46 23:06, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.