Talk:American Idol season 9

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Template:WikiProject Idol series

Birthdates?

Where are the sources for the birthdates? 24.14.30.172 (talk) 21:17, 14 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Articles for deletion

It is that time of the year again for the Articles for Deletion to start popping up for the American Idol finalists. Please join the discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Katie Stevens and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Siobhan Magnus. Aspects (talk) 23:51, 14 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I saw those AfDs and then found this. Is there any precedent for delaying such AfDs until after AI ends, at least among the top 12 assuming a verifiable article is established? Its generally my opinion that AfD nominations of major TV show contestants fare better and suffer less drama and distractions if you wait until the show is over. I suppose some feel waiting is some horrible offence though.--Milowent (talk) 19:17, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There isn't, but I also think that this is the work of a serial sockpuppeteer. His mode of operation is to pop up with an account, show profound knowledge of policy while nominating a ton of articles for deletion. If he is found to be a sockpuppeteer, I will close the AFD as it will be invalid because of the fact that the user was in the wrong to begin with. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 22:51, 17 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The articles have been kept, nothing more is needed. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 21:38, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Alex Lambert "controversy" section

This section is not a controversy and right now a third of it consists of a list of performances already mentioned in the article. Past versions included a link to a website and those versions seemed little more than linkspam to get people to sign a petition on the site. Unless there are reliable sources, this section should not be included. Aspects (talk) 23:05, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Alright, Aspects, Melinda Doolittle and Chris Daughtry's eliminations are counted as controversies on the page of the season they were on, and they didn't spark enough controversy for people to sign petitions. Second, there are plenty of better places to make "linkspam" then on Wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.107.17.32 (talk) 23:30, 15 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

DeWyze, not Dewyze

All of Lee's pre-Idol stuff (twitter, iTunes, Facebook) lists his name as DeWyze. For some reason, AI seems to keep the W in lowercase. Anyway we can make it DeWyze in the article without it being removed? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.102.208.111 (talk) 03:46, 16 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Agree. See "Get to Know Lee DeWyze" on the AI site:

http://www.americanidol.com/videos/season_9/lee_dewyze/get_to_know_lee_dewyze/ Raggedyland (talk) 02:17, 17 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"Bottom 2"

What makes any evidence that somebody is in the "bottom 2"? Just because they're not the first one of the bottom three to be saved, doesn't mean they were in the bottom 2. There is no evidence for this. Woogee (talk) 04:40, 18 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yep. It's sort of what I said above. We have to go by exactly what is said on the show. We can't take anything for granted. If Ryan says that this is the bottom 2, great. Otherwise, we can't assume anything. --User:Woohookitty ^{Disamming fool!} 06:03, 18 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

My request for proof that she was bottom 2 was removed without discussion. Woogee (talk) 06:18, 18 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

We could do what we did in Season 7 and put " Safe First " and " Safe Second ", because this is just confusing.

Um what's confusing about it? Both contestants were in the bottom 3. Why do we need anything further? In the end, it means absolutely nothing. Its not as if they have a scoring system. :) --User:Woohookitty ^{Disamming fool!} 06:40, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think the "saved first/saved last" distinctions are unnecessary and don't reveal anything about the results themselves. I just think it would be most appropriate if we listed both Paige and Tim as "Btm 3" because thats all we really know about their position this week. And then we can put "Btm 2" for the weeks when Ryan actually manages to acknowledge that the last two are the bottom two. Additionally, I've always hated the yellow gradient and I think we should shade all Btm 3 and Elim cells in the finals with the palegoldenrod color. That's how we used to do it prior to season 7 before people decided you needed a different color for every single little thing. In my opinion, the bold, bright yellow just jumps out way too much and doesn't mesh with the rest of the more toned-down colors used in the chart. MarkMc1990 (talk) 08:28, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Even though Ryan usually never acknowledges the two left standing as the 'bottom 2' it is heavily implied and so as a reader of this article, I would like to see a distinction between Tim and Paige's 'btm 3'.. The saved first/last is fine for me. 92.1.174.176 (talk) 19:46, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"Heavily implied" has no basis in reliable sourcing. Woogee (talk) 21:05, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I can live with the "safe first" and "safe second", but Bottom 2 and Bottom 3 are not supported by any sources, and therefore not acceptable. Woogee (talk) 21:08, 19 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Can we relax for a minute? Until there is some sort of implication from a reliable source, we will use the safe first/second method. –Turian (talk) 01:07, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Um why? I guess I just don't quite get why we have to use even that. In the end, does it matter one iota if someone was saved first or second? --User:Woohookitty ^{Disamming fool!} 04:36, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

And besides. Yes this was used for the season 7 article but the judges save didn't exist then. So now we have saved used twice in completely different contexts. I think thats more confusing than using Bottom 2 and 3. --User:Woohookitty ^{Disamming fool!} 04:40, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Does it really matter if we use bottom 2 or 3? I don't think Ryan has EVER used the words "bottom 2", but for the past 8 seasons we've been using BTM2 and BTM3. Now all of a sudden, in Season 9, we are going to demand " evidence ". Quite frankly, I don't see any reason why not to just make things easy and say Paige was in the bottom 2. AT40Reviewer (talk) 12:28, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Also, why does Ryan need to say "bottom 2" everytime? It's Season 9. I think people get the concept. And what reliable sources do you want? Next should we say that unless Ryan tells us the amount of votes each contestant had, we shouldn't even say the Lacey had the lowest number of votes because there's no proof? AT40Reviewer (talk) 12:32, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Look. WP:V is policy. I don't give a damn what happened in previous seasons. Provide reliable sources for your edits, or you'll be reverted. Period. Woogee (talk) 21:05, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't give a damn that what you want. Only about 3 people want your format, and everyone else wants the original format, as used in the past 8 SEASON. Wikipedia doesn't give a damn if everything's correct or not. The original format was a lot easier, until you guys fucked it up.76.107.17.32 (talk)

I wasn't trying to be rude. I think the safe first/second method is a great way to make both sides of the issue happy. I was just simply replying to what Woohookitty said about "does it really matter!" Does it really matter that they were in the bottom 3 period? People have been asking to reliable sources for Paige being in the bottom 2, but never ask for reliable sources about what the bottom 3 means to begin with. I don't think Ryan has ever said the bottom 3 meant the least number of votes on the show, so Paige could have just as well been brought up by random. That's why I thought we should just use the BTM2/3 thing because there is just as much evidence for Paige being the the bottom 3 as there is of her being in the bottom 2. That's all. AT40Reviewer (talk) 7:04, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Well the fact that Paige was in the bottom THREE was made explicitly clear. The evidence is right in the episode when Ryan said "Paige, you are in the bottom 3 tonight". There was no part of the episode where Ryan ever said she was in the bottom TWO. It's not wiki's job to say "We need proof she was actually in the bottom 3, the show might be lying". That's just ridiculous, and it certainly doesn't justify listing Btm 2 for someone when we have no evidence whatsoever to believe that. The bottom 3 are the bottom 3 vote-getters, what else would it mean? If they ever lie about who is in the bottom 3, or about what being in the bottom 3 actually means, then the show would be blatantly frauding the audience and the article isn't to assume such things. MarkMc1990 (talk) 20:05, 25 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Btm 2 got put in again and I reverted again. Woogee (talk) 02:20, 25 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Top 11 Performance Night

Someone needs to switch Didi Benami and Casey James, because Casey performed first. Not Didi. I would do it, but it won't let me edit.RonZombie91 (talk) 02:11, 24 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request

{{editsemiprotected}} Please let this page be edited by all wikipedia users.

Qdiazissipom (talk) 14:35, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Edit requests should not be used to make requests for article unprotections. To request that this article be unprotected, please make a request at Wikipedia:requests for page protection. You can check the protection log explaining the reasons for its protection and its expiration date here:[1]. --JokerXtreme (talk) 14:51, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Sing for Save

Can we put on the performance lists the song that the contestant chooses to fight for the save or in Paige's case, her swan song. Qdiazissipom (talk) 14:39, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Top 12 – The Rolling Stones

Order	Contestant	Song	Result
1	Michael Lynche	"Miss You"	Safe
2	Didi Benami	"Play with Fire"	Safe
3	Casey James	"It's All Over Now"	Safe
4	Lacey Brown	"Ruby Tuesday"	Bottom
5	Andrew Garcia	"Gimme Shelter"	Safe
6	Katie Stevens	"Wild Horses"	Safe
7	Tim Urban	"Under My Thumb"	Bottom 3
8	Siobhan Magnus	"Paint It, Black"	Safe
9	Lee DeWyze	"Beast of Burden"	Safe
10	Paige Miles	"Honky Tonk Women"	Bottom 3
11	Aaron Kelly	"Angie"	Safe
12	Crystal Bowersox	"You Can't Always Get What You Want"	Safe
Lowest Voted Contestant's Performance For Judges' Save
NA	Lacey Brown	"The Story" (Brandi Carlile)	Eliminated

Something like this? I understand that it needs to be tweaked but I think it's useful and is a necessary addition. Qdiazissipom (talk) 15:02, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it is anything important, and I find it kind of trivial. Most of the time, they will sing the same song, and like last week, the judges told Paige that it wouldn't matter, which I expect them to do from now on. –Turian (talk) 18:36, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think this would be a nice reference for future reference, since it seems like the contestants are able to chose their sing-out song regardless now. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.102.208.111 (talk) 04:52, 29 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Changing the Elimination Chart Proposal

Currently, throughout the entire American Idol series of articles, there is no consensus on what we should use for the elimination chart. I have put the two elimination charts currently used in my sandbox. The first one represents Season 3, and the second one represents Season 7. The third represents the current season under the first one's style.

I think we should use the first style for many reasons. The first reason is that the one for Season 3 is much easier on the eye than the one we are currently using. The cyan and pink background colors are nothing more than a distraction. I mean, we really don't need to hold people's hands to tell them that they are female or male. Also, the yellow used for Elim is extremely harsh, especially for an encyclopedia. The 'palegoldenrod' used for the header will match the gray we use for the semi-finals, providing consistency. If you take a look at both, you will see what I mean. The yellows and cyans and pinks are so clashing it almost looks childish. We should keep it more professional by using simpler and complementing colors. –Turian (talk) 04:58, 29 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm so glad someone finally agrees with me about that dumb yellow! I've missed the palegoldenrod. I completely agree that the elim boxes should match the header just like they do in the semifinals. Personally, and I know I'm in the minority on this one, I think the "Btm 3" boxes should be palegoldenrod as well. It used to be that way until season 7 when people decided everything needed a different color. Or at least, the gradient needs to match the palegoldenrod. MarkMc1990 (talk) 02:39, 31 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

safe	Bottom 3	Bottom 3	Eliminated

MarkMc1990 (talk) 02:47, 31 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, some type of gradient definitely needs to be used, and the bright colors (besides the green) need to go. –Turian (talk) 12:02, 31 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The colors still look very similar. It's hard to distinguish which is which. I suggest changing it a little bit.

Raiderfanforever99 (talk) 11:12, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It's a gradient; they are meant to look similar. And plus, if you get confused, just read it what is in the box. –Turian (talk) 18:56, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Raiderfanforever99, on my computer at home I can tell the difference between the shades of palegoldenrod, but on my work computer, where I am making this comment, I cannot tell the different between the "white" nothing shade and the two shades used for the "Bottom 3" cells. The only one that looks different is the Eliminated cell. Therefore the yellow's work better because you can more easily tell them apart. Also I do not feel the colors come across as childish or non-professional.

I think the pink/cyan color are necessary since the contestants were split up according to their sex and you can see two eliminated males/females each week. And as a side note, I have been keeping the first three season from using the pink/cyan colors because they are unnecessary for those seasons, because they were not split up male/female. Aspects (talk) 01:03, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Those are absolutely horrible reasons to not change it. If you are unable to tell the difference between a female and male contestant by reading the name or the article, then you would not even be reading the article. We can choose a different color for the bottom, so that is no reason to shoot it down. And 'I have been keeping...'? These are not your articles. If it is not changed here, then I will have it changed by higher powers through guideline restrictions. And it looks extremely childish. If you don't want to remove the colors, then perhaps we should add a gender symbol. But as it stands, it looks pathetically awful. –Turian (talk) 01:08, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Calling my opinions "horrible" is not a great way to start a discussion. You can tell by names like Lee, Casey, Aaron, Alex and Joe that they are males or females? I have known people of both sexes who spell their names that way. There are also the unusual names of Siobhan, Didi and Todrick that I would not be able to tell the gender. For the prior seasons, I was showing how they were attempted to use the pink/cyan colors and you would not have been able to use those as examples had I not justifiably changed them as unnecessary. Not being able to see the differences between the shades of palegoldenrod is not a horrible reason. In fact, calling the table "childish" and "pathetically awful" are more horrible reasons for changing them than any of the reasons I gave for keeping them. As for your "If it is not changed here, then I will have it changed by higher powers through guideline restrictions." that sound more like a threat for us to go with your way when this is basically a content dispute that should be decided here with a consensus. Aspects (talk) 02:54, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Call it a threat; I don't care. I'm just letting you know what I would do. Also, there is a list of male and female contestants on the article already; this is just redundant. I know this is your baby table, but it is not up to standards of professionalism expected here, regardless of what you say. We have 70000 different colors, and they all clash. –Turian (talk) 03:03, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see how making the Elimination Chart look like sandpaper is going to make it look " professional ". I think it would be more professional to use common colors, like red or blue. Personally, I think we should use the Elimination Chart format used in the Project Runway or Top Chef pages, using red for eliminated or bottom 3. AT40Reviewer (talk) 7:03, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

The current setup is not up to WP:COLOR standards for the color blind, as you can see here. Something obviously needs to change, which is why we need to use the 'palegoldenrod'. The current yellow setup is a huge issue for the colorblind. We can keep the male/female colors, but they need to change to something more matte and less harsh. Also, see my sandbox. –Turian (talk) 13:43, 4 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Turian that the gender colours are unnecessary as there are two tables with the top 6 male and female contestants in them. I also have an issue with the colour scheme for btm/btm2/btm3 generally. I think different shades of red would be much more appropriate as red has connotations of danger which, especially with the lack of clarity regarding 'Btm 2', seems appropriate as the three contestants are even addressed by Ryan as being 'in danger of going home'. When there are two contestants left standing centre stage, the slightly darker shade of red for the 'saved last' contestant seems appropriate as they are placed in increasing danger of going home as they are not 'saved first'. Say what you want but being 'saved first' implies heavily that the contestant had the largest amount of votes out of the 'btm 3'. Here is an example: Qdiazissipom (talk) 21:04, 4 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

**Legend**
Top 24	Top 12	Winner

Safe

Safe First

Safe Second

Eliminated

Judges' Save

Place	Contestant	Result
Stage:		Semi-Finals			Finals
Week:		2/25	3/4	3/11	3/17	3/24	3/31	4/7	4/14	4/21	4/28	5/5	5/12	5/19	5/26
	Siobhan Magnus
	Katie Stevens					Btm 3	Btm 3
	Tim Urban				Btm 3	Btm 3	Btm 3
10	Didi Benami						Elim
11	Paige Miles				Btm 3	Elim
12	Lacey Brown				Elim

While the red is better than the yellow, I think the palegoldenrod is more neutral. We don't want to spam colors because the style becomes more of an issue than the content. Also, the palegoldenrod matches the header, like the gray in the semi-finals. –Turian (talk) 21:09, 4 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it is necessary that the elim/btm 3 needs to match the palegoldenrod header. Red has connotations of danger which makes it a fitting colour especially when regarding the saved first and saved last contestant. I still think we should just put 'btm 2' like we have done for seasons 1 - 6 when it was never clarified if the last 2 standing were the btm 2 but oh well... i like the red. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Qdiazissipom (talk • contribs) 13:34, 5 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

After looking at the red, there is no way that it will go in the article. It is just as clashing as the yellow. Adding it makes us look like piss-poor editors. The table used for season three is the only table that actually looks somewhat nice. We don't need all of the flashy colors to differentiate between what is what. –Turian (talk) 14:25, 5 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ratings, please

What happened to the weekly ratings? There are empty spaces where the ratings for the last few weeks (shows 16 through 27) should be. Someone has fallen off the wagon here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.255.58.123 (talk) 04:41, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Bottom 2 / Bottom 3 / Saved First / Saved Last.... Let's Get It Finalised

From the perspective of someone who isn't completely familiar with American idol, when looking at the elimination chart I would assume the person would be confused over the use of 'Saved first' and 'Saved Last'. The use of those two phrases gives the impression that we are too stupid to simplify the confusion of the chart by putting 'bottom 2'. The fact that we are using 'Saved first' and 'saved last' shows that the order of safety has some significance and the fact that we are noting it as 'saved first' and 'saved last' makes it quite trivial. In seasons 1 - 6, we have used 'btm 2' for the contestant saved last. Since season 7 we have suddenly taken a serious approach to this which makes the elimination charts in seasons 1 - 6 all significantly incorrect. I personally think that we should note the 'saved last' contestant as 'btm 2' and put a footnote at the bottom saying something along the lines of 'Contestants noted as 'Btm 2' were the ones that Ryan announced as being the last safe'. The show itself heavily implies this. We should either do that or put 'bottom 3' and 'Elim' in the 'palegoldenrod' without any of this 'saved first' 'saved last' nonsense. Qdiazissipom (talk) 23:04, 5 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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