Jump to content

Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Animal rights

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by DFlhb (talk | contribs) at 11:24, 30 October 2023 (→Determining the future of B-checklists: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

WikiProject iconAnimal rights Project‑class
WikiProject iconThis page is within the scope of WikiProject Animal rights, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of animal rights on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Animal rightsWikipedia:WikiProject Animal rightsTemplate:WikiProject Animal rightsAnimal rights
ProjectThis page does not require a rating on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

Relationship between speciesism and the AIC

I've started a discussion on the relationship between speciesism and the animal-industrial complex. The link is here. Rasnaboy (talk) 07:41, 20 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Lack of neutrality on Faroese whaling article

I'm having a very hard time making edits to reduce the WP:UNDUE weight towards a pro-whaling on the Whaling_in_the_Faroe_Islands article. In this edit, a day ago, I tried to add triple WP:RS/PS material based on the 15 Sep mass dolphin killing event that was criticised both by anti-whaling campaigners and even some pro-whaling Faroese groups, but was blocked. I have been told that the page is not for news, i.e.: fairly unsubtle code not for any news that could shed a bad light on the subject. Assistance in addressing the bias at work on this page and in its editing would be appreciated. Iskandar323 (talk) 20:31, 21 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Article re-assessment request: SSCS

Is it appropriate to request the re-assessment of an article's rating here. I've recently done a lot of work to improve the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society article, rebalance its content away from historic events and the now quite dated saga with the Japanese whaling industry and focus on the charity's present work - though plenty more could still be added on this front. Anyway, is this the right place for this? Iskandar323 (talk) 20:36, 21 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Renaming and moving Animal rights and the Holocaust to "Animal holocaust"

There is an ongoing discussion regarding moving and renaming Animal rights and the Holocaust as "Animal holocaust". Rasnaboy (talk) 08:53, 29 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I've made an attempt to clean up the animal rights category. Where relevant, I've moved articles into the parent animal ethics category. I've also created new subcategories e.g. Category:History of animal rights.

There's a lot of articles which have Category:Animal rights, Category: Animal welfare and Category:Cruelty to animals. I'm thinking it's best to remove these from articles when they have parent (or grandparent categories) which are already in these categories e.g. this edit in Cormorant culling because these categories are included in Category:Animal killing. Let me know if I'm on the right track with this. I want to sense check before I go any further. Throughthemind (talk) 17:36, 10 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Another example of what I'm wondering about is whether the only (relevant category) for the Whaling in the Faroe Islands article should be Category:Hunting, since this category has the parent Category:Animal killing, which has the animal rights, welfare and cruelty to animals categories, rather than including the categories on the article itself. Throughthemind (talk) 17:42, 10 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Timeline of non-human personhood article idea

It would be nice to turn some of the content here into a timeline article: Personhood#Non-human_animals. I'm not sure whether it would be distinctive enough from Timeline of animal welfare and rights though. Let me know what you think. Throughthemind (talk) 17:13, 12 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes - or at least a set of linked articles that lead us through the discussion via current Wikipedia content. MaynardClark (talk) 21:33, 1 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Critics of animal rights needs to be improved

I have created about 30+ articles for animal rights advocates (mostly historical) but something that is lacking on Wikipedia is criticism of animal rights, specifically critics. We simply can't pretend that criticism of animal rights does not exist. In our categories we have 176 animal rights activists and 141 animal rights scholars. All these people believed in or believe in and have defended animal rights theories. What is missing is the critics. Our Critics of animal rights category only has 12 people and I click on some of their biographies and they have been neglected. Today I been doing a lot of research and have found about 20 critics of animal rights. I plan on working on new articles of critics and improving others that have been neglected. Any help with this would be appreciated. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:24, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

An early critic of animal rights that I have found is David George Ritchie. He authored a paper, "The Rights of Animals" in 1900. There seemed to be a debate between Henry Stephens Salt and Ritchie in the journal International Journal of Ethics [1]. These debates about "rights" have been going on for over 120 years. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:33, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Ritchie's arguments are still cited in the animal rights literature. "Ritchie attempts to demonstrate—via reductio ad absurdum—that animals cannot have rights, because granting them rights would oblige us to protect prey animals against predators that wrongly violate their rights." [2]. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:38, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Peter Singer, in his Animal Liberation, mentions one of the earliest critic of the animal rights movement—Thomas Taylor, a distinguished Cambridge philosopher. According to Singer, he arguably initiated the modern term "rights to animals" by his publication A Vindication of the Rights of Brutes aimed at mocking Mary Wollstonecraft's Vindication of the Rights of Woman. But, unlike Singer's statement, the Wiki article on him doesn't say he mocked animal rights. Not sure if he can be counted as a critic. Rasnaboy (talk) 06:29, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Agree that more work should be done on improving the critics. I've made some improvements to Ritchie's article and added Category:Critics of animal rights. There still needs to be a section on his criticism, with perhaps a link to the predation problem. Throughthemind (talk) 12:12, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the replies. I will do some work on Thomas Taylor and Ritchie's article. A few other modern critics of animal rights I have found are Jan Narveson who authored a paper "A Case Against Animal Rights" [3] and Peter Carruthers [4], [5]. The most notable critic of animal rights might have been Raymond Frey, I plan on doing a massive update for his article next month or so. Psychologist Guy (talk) 14:03, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Wesley J. Smith is also a critic of animal rights, I updated his article. Psychologist Guy (talk) 14:11, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Another critic I found and whose article I just fixed up was Paul W. Taylor. Another is H. J. McCloskey which I will update. Psychologist Guy (talk) 22:51, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Steve F. Sapontzis [6] lists H. J. McCloskey, Jan Narveson, Bonnie Steinbock, Leslie Francis, Richard Norman, R. G. Frey, Meredith Williams and Ruth Cigman as critics of animal rights. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:31, 3 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Articles to be improved

How about a section (in the WikiProject's article itself) that show articles requiring improvement'? MaynardClark (talk) 21:35, 1 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That's a good idea that I agree with. We can use the same table template as on WikiProject Veganism and Vegetarianism. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:25, 3 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Articles to be created

How about a section (in the WikiProject's article itself) that show articles requiring development? I had been thinking recently of Kim Crumbo, missing environmentalist celebrated recently by Animals 24-7[1], a periodical which IMO deserves an article. MaynardClark (talk) 21:35, 1 November 2021 (UTC) How about developing articles for each of the obituaries written by Animals 24-7? MaynardClark (talk) 11:44, 19 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Google search for "Kim Crumbo"

Animal loss

I included the Animal loss article in this project and suggest that, in light of the seemingly growing movement for holding animal memorial services and 'animal funerals, the topic of memorial events for beloved animals who pass away be sensitively developed and possibly included as a section here (or as a separate article). MaynardClark (talk) 21:42, 1 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Death of animals

We need to reflect on the struggle to understand death as mortality, not merely of humans OR nonhumans, but of sentient life, in which we all participate. MaynardClark (talk) 20:22, 2 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Betty White

MaynardClark thanks for raising the issue of Betty White. Here is a website I found that mentions her "According to Smithsonian Magazine, White has served as a trustee of the Greater Los Angeles Zoo Association for over 40 years. She has also worked with the Morris Animal Foundation, been associated with PETA, and still works closely with the Los Angeles ASPCA." [7] sounds like an advocate of animal welfare, not rights. Psychologist Guy (talk) 02:46, 4 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I was right, here is a comment from Betty White "I'm not into animal rights. I'm only into animal welfare and health" [8] Psychologist Guy (talk) 02:56, 4 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

CITES

Should CITES be considered within the scope of this project????

CITES (shorter name for the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora, also known as the Washington Convention) is a multilateral treaty to protect endangered plants and animals. It was drafted as a result of a resolution adopted in 1963 at a meeting of members of the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN). The convention was opened for signature in 1973 and CITES entered into force on 1 July 1975.
Its aim is to ensure that international trade in specimens of wild animals and plants does not threaten the survival of the species in the wild, and it accords varying degrees of protection to more than 35,000 species of animals and plants. In order to ensure that the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade (GATT) was not violated, the Secretariat of GATT was consulted during the drafting process.[1]

I would think so.

In addition to:

  • CITES (Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora)

I would also ask about:

OTOH, perhaps the nature of the working group as a group concerned for the well-being, protection, and reverence for the living interests of animals would precluded including some of the broader-view topics (but perhaps not). MaynardClark (talk) 18:48, 8 November 2021 (UTC) MaynardClark (talk) 18:42, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think CITES should be included, since it is focused on the preservation of species, rather than helping individual non-human animals. Animal rights as a concept is about the rights of individual animals, rather than the preservation of abstract entities like species, so conservation related articles should only be considered part of this project if they are relevant to the well-being and interests of these individuals e.g. compassionate conservation and culling (for further reading see: relationship between animal ethics and environmental ethics). Based on this inclusion criteria, I do think a few of these articles that @MaynardClark mentions would be relevant, but not all. Throughthemind (talk) 21:50, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Environmentalists DO discuss (and debate) whether species and even ecosystems should be considered as 'rights bearers'. OTOH, consequentialist Peter Singer does not believe in the concept of rights, which he considers to be a concept of deontology and perhaps Kantian. My understanding is that Kantian abolitionist Gary Francione argues that the essence of the meaning of rights is that they cannot be traded off for some consequentialist purposes (even if the greater good were to be achieved). No lawyer for any individual (in a courtroom situation?) would be willing to trade off any client's basic rights for any reason. What is not brought into discussion is the need for a political state to ensure or guarantee rights of any kind(s). MaynardClark (talk) 02:17, 9 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that environmentalists discuss the rights of species and ecosystems, but I would still say that most environmentalist focused articles should be out of scope for this WikiProject because of their lack of focus on individual animals. It's also true about Singer's utilitarianism rejecting rights, but his philosophy does focus on animals as individuals, which is the key thing. Throughthemind (talk) 11:29, 9 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "What is CITES?". cites.org. CITES. Retrieved 13 February 2012.

New proposal for WikiProject Effective altruism

Hey everyone, I've created a WikiProject proposal to support efforts to improve articles related to effective altruism, a social movement about doing good effectively. Effective altruism is inspired by the philosophy of Peter Singer and has a strong emphasis on reducing suffering experienced by animals, especially farm animals. For example, The Humane League and Mercy for Animals, two organizations based on effective altruism, have organized corporate campaigns and legal reforms in the United States which contributed to the dramatic shift to cage-free egg production, and Open Philanthropy is the world's largest funder of farm animal advocacy.[1] Effective altruism is highly interdisciplinary and focuses on several other cause areas though, so I thought it would be good to have a dedicated WikiProject for it. If you're interested, please write a comment supporting the WikiProject proposal here. Enervation (talk) 15:32, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Why the future of animal welfare lies beyond the West".

Shirley McGreal

Shirley McGreal, the founder of the International Primate Protection League, has died. I just created her article yesterday. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you, Thriley (talk) 01:36, 15 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for creating this article it is a good start, I would point out though that that Shirley McGreal was an animal welfare activist, not anything to do with animal rights. There is a big difference (although they are sometimes confused). The 3 sources in the lead all mention animal welfare, not rights. There is a good obituary in the New York Times [9] that was cited that we all have full access to so the article can be expanded. I can have a go at that tomorrow. Psychologist Guy (talk) 01:50, 15 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion regarding lead image on Animal cruelty and the Holocaust analogy

I have begun a discussion on the talk page of Animal cruelty and the Holocaust analogy regarding the lead images used in this article. Please see the images for yourself, and I would appreciate any input from this project's members. See Talk:Animal cruelty and the Holocaust analogy#Lead image used in article for further discussion. Thank you! —AFreshStart (talk) 14:38, 20 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Faxian's quote on vegetarianism in ancient India

There is an ongoing discussion regarding the relevance of Faxian's quote on vegetarianism in ancient India. Rasnaboy (talk) 18:34, 4 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Need a user welcome template

Similar to the template {{subst:Invite Veganism and Vegetarianism}} of the WikiProject Vegetarianism and Veganism, I feel we need a similar welcome template for WikiProject Animal rights as well. Rasnaboy (talk) 17:51, 22 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

User script to detect unreliable sources

Main page: User:Headbomb/unreliable

I have (with the help of others) made a small user script to detect and highlight various links to unreliable sources and predatory journals. Some of you may already be familiar with it, given it is currently the 39th most imported script on Wikipedia. The idea is that it takes something like

  • John Smith "Article of things" Deprecated.com. Accessed 2020-02-14. (John Smith "[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14.)

and turns it into something like

It will work on a variety of links, including those from {{cite web}}, {{cite journal}} and {{doi}}.

The script is mostly based on WP:RSPSOURCES, WP:NPPSG and WP:CITEWATCH and a good dose of common sense. I'm always expanding coverage and tweaking the script's logic, so general feedback and suggestions to expand coverage to other unreliable sources are always welcomed.

Do note that this is not a script to be mindlessly used, and several caveats apply. Details and instructions are available at User:Headbomb/unreliable. Questions, comments and requests can be made at User talk:Headbomb/unreliable.

- Headbomb {t · c · p · b}

This is a one time notice and can't be unsubscribed from. Delivered by: MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:00, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relevance of Faxian's quote in the article History of Animal Rights

I've started a discussion regarding the relevance of adding Faxian's quote on vegetarianism in ancient India in the article History of animal rights. The link is here: Talk:History of animal rights § Faxian's quote on Vegetarianism in ancient India. Rasnaboy (talk) 09:57, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Eyestalk ablation for Translation of the week

Hello! I'm reaching out to you because in October, I proposed the English-language article Eyestalk ablation for the Translation of the week project. So far, it's gotten 3 votes and 1 opposition. Given your interest in divulging animal rights, I thought you might be prompted to vote for it and make it available in many more languages. Thank you beforehand! --Brunnaiz (talk) 12:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Rita Miljo

Rita Miljo's article describes her as an "animal rights pioneer" but this is not supported by any source on the article. I think animal welfare is more accurate for her work. Psychologist Guy (talk) 17:54, 8 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Project-independent quality assessments

Quality assessments are used by Wikipedia editors to rate the quality of articles in terms of completeness, organization, prose quality, sourcing, etc. Most wikiprojects follow the general guidelines at Wikipedia:Content assessment, but some have specialized assessment guidelines. A recent Village pump proposal was approved and has been implemented to add a |class= parameter to {{WikiProject banner shell}}, which can display a general quality assessment for an article, and to let project banner templates "inherit" this assessment.

No action is required if your wikiproject follows the standard assessment approach. Over time, quality assessments will be migrated up to {{WikiProject banner shell}}, and your project banner will automatically "inherit" any changes to the general assessments for the purpose of assigning categories.

However, if your project decides to "opt out" and follow a non-standard quality assessment approach, all you have to do is modify your wikiproject banner template to pass {{WPBannerMeta}} a new |QUALITY_CRITERIA=custom parameter. If this is done, changes to the general quality assessment will be ignored, and your project-level assessment will be displayed and used to create categories, as at present. Aymatth2 (talk) 14:01, 9 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Peter Singer

On Peter Singer's article he is listed on the animal rights template and under the animal rights scholars category. As far as I know Singer is not a rights advocate and has never described himself as such. The animal welfare template might be more appropriate. Please discuss. Psychologist Guy (talk) 21:37, 10 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Guru Jambheshwar

An early advocate of animal welfare, any help expanding the article would be appreciated. Psychologist Guy (talk) 20:45, 3 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Determining the future of B-checklists

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council § Determining the future of B-class checklists. This project is being notified since it is one of the 82 WikiProjects that opted to support B-checklists (B1-B6) in your project banner. DFlhb (talk) 11:24, 30 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Animal_rights&oldid=1182621814"