Talk:The Left Hand of Darkness

Copyright violation?

Several paragraphs of this article are straight copies from the Scifi.com review that it also links to ( http://www.scifi.com/sfw/issue116/classic.html ). I think the article (and the book) deserves better than this, although if a review is underway I'm sure it'll be addressed soon. I think more analysis of the concepts and content (and messages?) of the book would be welcome, though I'm terrible at such things myself. --StoneColdCrazy 17:59, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

I've verified the copyright violation and removed the material, which was added all in one edit. Justin Johnson 04:28, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Mary Sue Comment

I've removed the following addition:

Teresa Nielsen Hayden and Joanna Russ have noted that the novel can be considered a form of Mary Sue fiction.

I don't necessarily disagree with it (though I don't see how they two could say that). The problem is that it's an opaque criticism: The line as included says only that TNH and JR claim this, not why or how they claim this.

If you're going to add this line, please include either a brief exposition of the parallels between LHOD and Mary Sue-ism in fiction, or link to the arguments presented by TNH and JR. Without that, it's really just a meaningless slap at le Guin. JJ 22:30, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Having read the THN article linked in the Mary Sue article, I'm still not convinced the content should be added, since in THN's blog entry, the entirety of LHOD's mention is:

I, considering it, said “Which is not to say that The Left Hand of Darkness is a specimen of Star Trek slash fiction.” Joanna's jaw dropped, and we stared at each other in wild surmise. The patterns not only fitted; they explained some otherwise inexplicable plot twists in that novel." [1]

No argument or analysis on why this is so, just an offhand remark that two sci-fi authors once, in conversation, analysed it as such.

If that line is going to be added back, I would suggest making some effort to explain how the theory of Mary-sue-ism fits LHOD. Otherwise, it remains an opaque attack on the work. JJ 23:06, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

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What is the meaning of "The Left Hand of Darkness"?

As I recall, it's light in this case. Hold on . . . yes, a little online investigation tells me I'm right. The novel deals a lot with themes of duality and opposition, and unity-in-duality. The narrator brings up the yin-yang in one conversation with someone from Winter, saying that the Gethenian embodies the symbol: "Light, dark. Fear, courage. Cold, warmth. Female, male. It is yourself, Therem. Both and one."--4.17.135.10 22:59, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Dodgy logic on the reason Gethen was created

My recollection is that the book says that despite being called Gethen ('winter') the planet was in fact much warmer when it was initially settled by colonists. I am not certain that this was its original name. It would therefore not be correct to say that the genetic modification of the peoples was designed to help surviving the climate. That happened after the collapse of the galactic civilisation which had set up the experiment. I think it aludes directly to the Ekumen view being that this was a deliberate social experiment. The ice, coming later, did indeed affect how the people live - making major war campaigning impractical- but this was not an original part of the scheme. I havn't altered the text on this point, but i think it is wrong. Sandpiper 01:30, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Tone of Article

I was once surprised to discover a female friend had been recommended to read the book as a feminist work. From my own POV it screamed 'gay' from the start. It is something of a love story between genly Ai and Therem Hath rem ir Estraven, who at least initially is presented also as a male character. It explores Ai's difficulties coming to terms with Estraven's dual sexuality and attractiveness to him. My friend failed to get into the book, perhaps because she only read the first chapter, which opens as a quite straightforward sf/costume drama setting. It is only later that the reader realises that the assumptions LeGuin sets up at the opening about the particular characters are, in fact, totally wrong. This theme goes right through the book, she sets up a situation and then shows how it plays differently on gethen. But in the end it shows a stunning support for traditional heroic nationalism, expressed in the individual Gethenian way, when the individual, Lord Estraven, sacrifices his life for the good of the people. All this complicated by the fact that the Karhidish king, who has taken a political position totally opposed to Estraven, is nonetheless also somewhat in love with him.

It is certainly not true that 'sexual conflicts play no part on gethenian society'. It is true that sexual differences have been eliminated, but the business of love and jealousy continues just the same and plays an important part in the story.

"Nations exist, and different places have different societies, but they blend at the edges". I'm not sure they do. The difference between karhide and Orgoreyn is rather sharp and is defined exactly at the border. Orgoreyn is presented as a rather more politically centralised country to Karhide, and in a sense is there to show exactly what estraven is opposing. Orgoreyn is something of a communist totalitarian state, contrasted with the feudal kingdom of karhide. This is a conflict of ideologies existing upon gethen, rather than something to do with the climate or genetic tampering. LeGuin is here presenting the similiarities between Gethenian and human societies, despite the physical differences. But into this she places a third example, a greatly unified sense of family and community. Estraven, as expert politican, seeks to mainipulate the opportunities presented by this visitor from space to gain advantage for Karhide.

To return to the title of this subsection, I'm not at all sure the tone of the article as I found it well represents the book. Sandpiper 01:30, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

The sense in which "sexual conflicts play no part on gethenian society" is at the social level--the conflicts you identify (love triangles, jealousy) are at the individual level. Socially, though, there's no division of labour based on sex/gender, nor sexual stereotypes to be fulfilled/overcome, nor an insitutional power imbalance. The novel is feminist at least in the sense that it's an explicit exploration of a society in which the premise of radical feminism, that gender roles are the fundamental division upon which power is divided in our society, is not applicable.

Calling the work 'gay' seems to miss the point: 'heterosexuality' and 'homosexuality' are meaningless terms in Gethenian society. To the extent that Genly Ai is seen as perverse, it's because he remains fixed in one gender, and not because of the gender he 'chooses'. I'm not saying that queer identity doesn't play a part in the novel, but I wouldn't identify it as an overarching theme since there's no discussion at all in the book about the role played by a minority sexual orientation.

The reason I wrote that nations "blend at the edges" is the passages in which Ai is at the border, and, IIRC, he describes the people there as a comfortable mix of the two nations, with no particular allegiance to either one. The purpose of the centrally directed raiding that occurs is just to keep the borders sharp, to retain at least at a little bit of 'those people over there are our enemies'. Yes, Orgoreyn is an ideologically separate place from Karhide, but that's due to geography and local power politics, where members of other nations are artificially demonized as a means of distinguishing 'them' from 'us'.

I'm not saying nationalism is absent, but le Guin's point seems to me to be that it's artificially emphasized for the purposes of local politics; the uglier side of nationalism that leads to war lacks a critical mass in the book just because of the nearly subconscious realization they all have from gender-switching that the differences just aren't that great. Justin Johnson 23:38, 7 August 2006 (UTC)